ROFLMFAOGriMo wrote:pros: easier cleaning, better accuracy, barrel life. less fouling.
cons: pusty might get dirt under his nails
Do you post as Gryphon on other forums??, you seem to sprout just as much shit
Barrel Run In???
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MadMick
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singleshot
- .17 HMR
- Posts: 231
- Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2006 8:45 pm
- Location: Darling Downs SE Qld
I only shoot targets, F Class and have just finnished running in a barrel.
I only use stainless barrels and always run them in.
While running in a barrel I work up loads, chronograph, fireform etc etc. so it is not a pointless process.
I fire one shot and clean. 2 and clean. Then groups of 5 shots and cleaning. I am ready for competition after approx. 30 shots.
Cameron
I only use stainless barrels and always run them in.
While running in a barrel I work up loads, chronograph, fireform etc etc. so it is not a pointless process.
I fire one shot and clean. 2 and clean. Then groups of 5 shots and cleaning. I am ready for competition after approx. 30 shots.
Cameron
After 1200 rounds through my fairy gun (.243), I received some advice from Keith Hills here in Canberra to use Brasso a couple of times cause I had some stubborn copper in the throat area and also about 4 inches from the muzzle.
So, I used Brasso and also Iosso bore cleaner and for the first time ever, I had almost NIL copper fouling in the barrel after a range session. Previously, it took me hours to scrub it out.
Anyway, I am about to get a 20-.223 from Shane and my question to the group is: should we be using a small amount of Brasso of Iosso in the barrel break-in period?? And I mean small - maybe one or two patches stroked 4-6 times each... But it may help to polish the bore a bit more - just like it has done with my .243.
Cheers
So, I used Brasso and also Iosso bore cleaner and for the first time ever, I had almost NIL copper fouling in the barrel after a range session. Previously, it took me hours to scrub it out.
Anyway, I am about to get a 20-.223 from Shane and my question to the group is: should we be using a small amount of Brasso of Iosso in the barrel break-in period?? And I mean small - maybe one or two patches stroked 4-6 times each... But it may help to polish the bore a bit more - just like it has done with my .243.
Cheers
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Ned Kelly
- .270 Winchester
- Posts: 1277
- Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:39 am
- Favourite Cartridge: 6PPC
- Location: Macedon Ranges Vic
G'Day all,
you wouldn't go and flog a new car engine without a little care to allow it all to settle in. So given that your total barrel life is about 6-12 seconds of bullet inside your barrel, i'd rather try and make sure I get my optimum performance from running in. a good BR grade barrel should run in with about 10 rounds. I have a video from Lilja of a take off factory barrel that will turn you white with fear, his match grade is beautiful to see, so why not run it in to protect your investment?
Cheerio Ned
you wouldn't go and flog a new car engine without a little care to allow it all to settle in. So given that your total barrel life is about 6-12 seconds of bullet inside your barrel, i'd rather try and make sure I get my optimum performance from running in. a good BR grade barrel should run in with about 10 rounds. I have a video from Lilja of a take off factory barrel that will turn you white with fear, his match grade is beautiful to see, so why not run it in to protect your investment?
Cheerio Ned
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kjd
- Site Admin
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- Location: Picton
- Contact:
Ned,
I don't think the engine vs barrel is a very good comparison to draw from plus if you read the thread it has been discussed and my reasons for not doing it have been clearly made.
Now you might love breaking in a barrel and thats cool but personally I see no point and have witnessed any difference between the two. Bet you my bunnies are just as dead as yours!!
I don't think the engine vs barrel is a very good comparison to draw from plus if you read the thread it has been discussed and my reasons for not doing it have been clearly made.
Now you might love breaking in a barrel and thats cool but personally I see no point and have witnessed any difference between the two. Bet you my bunnies are just as dead as yours!!
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Ned Kelly
- .270 Winchester
- Posts: 1277
- Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:39 am
- Favourite Cartridge: 6PPC
- Location: Macedon Ranges Vic
G'Day All,
I dont see why not they are both internal combustion engines with a piston! One has its fuel injected the other has its fuel within the cylinder behind the piston.
besides there's no way known I would shoot any barrel without running it in and as for the video, the factory barrel looks like a file and the match barrel looks like a mirror. either way you need to burnish the tooling marks on both and running in does that, it just takes longer with a factory barrel
My point is by running in the barrel you can obtain optimum accuracy for the life of that barrel. And for the life of the barrel this aslo means a proper cleaning regime and if you really want the longest life from it no fire breathing loads..............if you do load red hot loads and treat your barrels throat to a blow torch each shot then yes you dont need to run it in 'cause you will be needing a new barrel before too long!
Cheerio Ned
I dont see why not they are both internal combustion engines with a piston! One has its fuel injected the other has its fuel within the cylinder behind the piston.
besides there's no way known I would shoot any barrel without running it in and as for the video, the factory barrel looks like a file and the match barrel looks like a mirror. either way you need to burnish the tooling marks on both and running in does that, it just takes longer with a factory barrel
My point is by running in the barrel you can obtain optimum accuracy for the life of that barrel. And for the life of the barrel this aslo means a proper cleaning regime and if you really want the longest life from it no fire breathing loads..............if you do load red hot loads and treat your barrels throat to a blow torch each shot then yes you dont need to run it in 'cause you will be needing a new barrel before too long!
Cheerio Ned
Last edited by Ned Kelly on Mon Nov 13, 2006 7:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Ned Kelly
- .270 Winchester
- Posts: 1277
- Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:39 am
- Favourite Cartridge: 6PPC
- Location: Macedon Ranges Vic
G'day All,
I do use JB's but I use it carefully and only if I know there is copper in the barrel. It is my initial attack on the copper. I prefer the chemical method to remove the final traces of copper. I'm reluctant to use JB's for too long at the muzzle and concentrate from the chamber to about the mid point. I want to keep any taper from the chamber to muzzle intact in order to maintain accuracy.
I use GM top engine cleaner which is 99% identical to Shooters Choice and follow up with Sweets to ensure there is no copper. If I get copper I'll use JB's to remove it and Sweets to prove its gone. I let Sweets stay in the barrel for about 5-10 minutes and then fresh Sweets until I know the copper is gone.
Anyone who says Sweets is bad for your barrel is kidding themselves............every shot is a momentary blow torch with a flame temperature higher than the melt temp of the steel. A little chemical etching of the steel (if it actually occurs) is nothing compared to the firing of a round and a clean barrel is an accurate barrel.
Cheerio Ned
I do use JB's but I use it carefully and only if I know there is copper in the barrel. It is my initial attack on the copper. I prefer the chemical method to remove the final traces of copper. I'm reluctant to use JB's for too long at the muzzle and concentrate from the chamber to about the mid point. I want to keep any taper from the chamber to muzzle intact in order to maintain accuracy.
I use GM top engine cleaner which is 99% identical to Shooters Choice and follow up with Sweets to ensure there is no copper. If I get copper I'll use JB's to remove it and Sweets to prove its gone. I let Sweets stay in the barrel for about 5-10 minutes and then fresh Sweets until I know the copper is gone.
Anyone who says Sweets is bad for your barrel is kidding themselves............every shot is a momentary blow torch with a flame temperature higher than the melt temp of the steel. A little chemical etching of the steel (if it actually occurs) is nothing compared to the firing of a round and a clean barrel is an accurate barrel.
Cheerio Ned
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kjd
- Site Admin
- Posts: 4424
- Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2006 6:27 pm
- Favourite Cartridge: 223Rem
- Location: Picton
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Ned,
The problem with the whole engine comparison is that the piston is of a similar hardness to the cylinder. Copper is much softer then a barrel. Also they work totally different its just a silly silly comparison. I dont see how running a patch and brush up and down dozens of times after each shot for the first how many shots is going to do anything worthwhile when you have the heat of the powder gasses and the copper/lead projectile flying out of there at such a speed. So how is getting in there with your little cleaning rod gonna do anything worth while when you have all that going on?
But please find another comparison because the engine one clearly isn't water tight!
The problem with the whole engine comparison is that the piston is of a similar hardness to the cylinder. Copper is much softer then a barrel. Also they work totally different its just a silly silly comparison. I dont see how running a patch and brush up and down dozens of times after each shot for the first how many shots is going to do anything worthwhile when you have the heat of the powder gasses and the copper/lead projectile flying out of there at such a speed. So how is getting in there with your little cleaning rod gonna do anything worth while when you have all that going on?
But please find another comparison because the engine one clearly isn't water tight!
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MadMick
Hiya Ned
Mate, have you ever seen how they run in a race engine?, I think its fair to say a race engine can be compared to a top performing rifle yes? .
Finish building it and then rev the living shit out of it, basically that's how I run all my cars in, and yes, I buy them new, and also that's how I run my rifles in.
I have yet to blow an engine up, and if you ask anyone that's ever been in a car with me, I don't drive softly. I have also never burnt a barrel out of any rifle I have ever owned. Granted I do not shoot bench rest comps, but I will head shoot roo's 19 times out or 20.
For a hunting rifle, I reckon you are pulling ya pud running it in, on a comp rifle, if it makes you feel better, go for it, but I'll bet my left one it doesn't make a zac of difference
Mate, have you ever seen how they run in a race engine?, I think its fair to say a race engine can be compared to a top performing rifle yes?
.Finish building it and then rev the living shit out of it, basically that's how I run all my cars in, and yes, I buy them new, and also that's how I run my rifles in.
I have yet to blow an engine up, and if you ask anyone that's ever been in a car with me, I don't drive softly. I have also never burnt a barrel out of any rifle I have ever owned. Granted I do not shoot bench rest comps, but I will head shoot roo's 19 times out or 20.
For a hunting rifle, I reckon you are pulling ya pud running it in, on a comp rifle, if it makes you feel better, go for it, but I'll bet my left one it doesn't make a zac of difference
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Ned Kelly
- .270 Winchester
- Posts: 1277
- Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:39 am
- Favourite Cartridge: 6PPC
- Location: Macedon Ranges Vic
G'day Mick,
each to his own, what I do gives me confidence in my gear that allows me to shoot to my best, if what you do works for you that fine too!
I was offering an opinion based on years of BR and varminting, but this I do I know, I get the maximum performance and life out of my barrels and I reckon people out there will make up there own minds as to whether running in counts or not. Eitherway running in cannot hurt and if that gives me the confidence I need at the bench or to take a difficult long shot while varminting then it has done its job!
Cheerio Ned
each to his own, what I do gives me confidence in my gear that allows me to shoot to my best, if what you do works for you that fine too!
I was offering an opinion based on years of BR and varminting, but this I do I know, I get the maximum performance and life out of my barrels and I reckon people out there will make up there own minds as to whether running in counts or not. Eitherway running in cannot hurt and if that gives me the confidence I need at the bench or to take a difficult long shot while varminting then it has done its job!
Cheerio Ned
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MadMick
Hi Ned
Mate, the "pulling pud" comment was a general comment and not aimed at you personally.
I agree with what you say, and as I said, "if it works for you, go for it" .
My opinion was also based on over 30 years experience with both engines and rifles, and I always get the best out of mine too, without running them in
Mate, the "pulling pud" comment was a general comment and not aimed at you personally.
I agree with what you say, and as I said, "if it works for you, go for it"
.My opinion was also based on over 30 years experience with both engines and rifles, and I always get the best out of mine too, without running them in
Maybe there is a compromise...
Most new rifles will need approximately 10 shots to accurately sight in. (I know it can be done with as little as two shots, but its not that easy...). These shots are UNAVOIDABLE...
Maybe we could use this period to do a barrel run in?
Say:
1 shot at 50m & clean (first sighting shot at 50m)
1 shot at 50m & clean (second sighting shot at 50m)
1 shot at 100m & clean (first shot at 100m)
3 shots at 100m & clean (find out where you grouping aim point is)
3 shots at 100m or 200m & clean (check final aim point)
1 shot (have a go at the 500m ram for the hell of it !!)
Just a thought - would only take a couple of hours really.
Most new rifles will need approximately 10 shots to accurately sight in. (I know it can be done with as little as two shots, but its not that easy...). These shots are UNAVOIDABLE...
Maybe we could use this period to do a barrel run in?
Say:
1 shot at 50m & clean (first sighting shot at 50m)
1 shot at 50m & clean (second sighting shot at 50m)
1 shot at 100m & clean (first shot at 100m)
3 shots at 100m & clean (find out where you grouping aim point is)
3 shots at 100m or 200m & clean (check final aim point)
1 shot (have a go at the 500m ram for the hell of it !!)
Just a thought - would only take a couple of hours really.