Tony Z A Question

[johno1]

How much wood do you like to remove from the barrel channel in front of the recoil lug on a CZ 527.

I know Calhoon and a lot of other CZ fans only bed about 25mm in front of the receiver but I don't want to get carried away with the dremel

Johno

[Camel]

When I bed my rifles, I relieve around the recoil lug and then take at least 1/8th inch out of the barrel channel for around an inch, generally I dont worry about measuring as it doesnt really make much difference if you go a little under or over the inch. I also relieve and bed around the tang. Wrap some electrical tape around the barrel at the end of the fore end so it centers in the barrel channel.

[johno1]

Pretty much how I was going to go Mark was just checking if Tony did anything different.

Interesting comment by Calhoon and this man builds tack drivers "avoid getting bedding material in the bottom of the recoil lug space it needs to have a gap on the underside" words to that effect

Johno

[trevort]

Johno have you seen Tony post
Much about czs? I thought he was fond of T3s


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[johno1]

Trev, i'm thinking outside the box, he talks of a 7.62x39, yes? CZ make them, yes?

Somewhere there is some logic mate maybe you can find it I can't

Christmas will soon be over and I will return to normal That other stuff we spoke about by pm I will get to you after the mad season mate

Johno

[pisco]

i have read a lot on bedding rifles ,i have listened to a lot of knowledgeable blokes ,i have looked at a lot of ytube sights on bedding,i do the bedding jobs at a local gun shop and i fill around the recoil lug and have never had one complaint or problem

[kickinback]

The gap at the bottom of the recoil lug is to prevent the lug coming into contact with any debris that may find its way in there when the action is removed and refitted.


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[johno1]

Glen, Tony, Calhoon recommends the doing around the lug but keeping the bottom free, this is based on the huge temperature variation in Montana reckons it has the same effect as pulling an action down tight into wood that is not pillar bedded. Probably does'nt so much here as we don't go from zub zero 3 ft of snow to really hot summer

Johno

[Tony Z]

Johno there was two trains of thought with mauser actions. (The CZs are mauser like in my view and i include Ruger, Win 70s and early Sakos in that lot as well).
One was bed the action area first allowing clearance front, sides and underneath the recoil lug. Once that epoxy set, a shim was placed under the flat behind the recoil lug and then 25 mm or so of the barrel was bedded. Once cured the shim was removed and the action was put back in and torqued down thus giving a positive upward pressure on the barrel. It was flawed in my view for year in year out zero retention as wood moves due to humidity. The action was under constant stress and POI shifted as the actions temperature altered. It may have been fine for target full bore rifles in those days way back when mausers were still used and the scoring zone was twice what it is now, but really it was a waste of time and money.
The best success i had with actions of this type was bed under the reciever ring and recoil lug with no front, side or bottom contact. Just the rear of the lug and the flat of action behind the lug contact the bedding. The rear tang is only bedded underneath. Preferably both front and rear using an alloy pillar.
Now the barrel, and this is what many miss or fail to comprehend. That is bedded for about 25 or 30 mm and a full hemisphere as per usual. Then a debris channel is milled in at 6 o'clock about 6 to 8 mm wide. This leaves two contact pads (guides) at 4 and 8 o'clock running parallel to the barrel and stock channel. (Simple V block concept used by some alloy rail insert in stocks for cylindrical actions like Rem 700). This is your return to battery rails and is the single most important part of the bedding as it is what repeatedly centers the action in the stock and guides the whole action in the return to battery concept.
The rear and sides of the tang and the entire remaining action surface not being bedded must be well clear of the stock. Ruger and Win 70 actions, that middle screw gets tossed.
The bottom of the tang that contacts the bedding material should be polished smooth. This area is critical as it is torqued down 25% less than the main action screw. It moves during recoil, and the timber alters as the temp and moisture content change over time where the smooth polished surface allows it to do so unhindered. In bigger cartridges the stock can compress a lot under recoil and extend on recovery(returns to battery). The tang allows some slip, the pads on the barrel guide it true.

From a personal view, i believe all mauser type actions should be bedded, along with all SMLE rifles, in a cubic metre of Ready Mix's finest. I have had a lot of good results bedding actions as described above but as Trev said, i favor T3s and 700s as they are easier in the way things align ready for the next shot.

No matter how you choose to bed your CZ, if you feel movement of the barrel and stock as individual screws are tightened and loosened, the bedding is not as good as it could be. That goes for any action type in any stock, timber, alloy or synthetic.
There are bedding jobs and there are bedding jobs. The best way to tell is fire a group. Remove the action. Put it back in and shoot a group again. If there is shift, it is not neutral and needs re-doing.

[Rabbitz]

And here endth the lesson.

Thanks for sharing your knowledge on the forum. It is most appreciated.

[pisco]

i have a mate that inherited his late fathers sako 22-250 and we pulled it apart to adjust the trigger and it was bedded around the recoil lug and it turned out to be a tack holer ,i know every one has there own ways and they obviously work

[johno1]

Many thanks for the tips Tony, I should have read the the cubic meter comment before I had a go, only used 1/2 m and did fill the area under the barrel in front of the receiver, i'll rough that up with the dremel and bring in another truck load of ready mix

Just to be clear Calhoon does bed the recoil lug but not the underneath side as ive said due the huge change in temp, it makes sense I see a lot on saubier do exactly the same thing.

I'd shoot it up to you to bed for me but the all up cost makes it impractical so I will box on

Johno