help in selecting a scope please

[HiWall]

How are you going with the road test on the Vortex scope Rinso? - semi waiting for a read-up on it - It may be just the thing for my .240 - it is a varmint type gizmo with a 28" barrel so I want something with a bit of oomph in the magnification department.

I can land a Leupold VX-III 8.5-25x50mm at my door, ex the U.S. for just over $AU1K, or a Leupold Leupold VX-III 6.5 - 20x40 AO for just over $AU800 so the Vortex sounds like a good alternative.

[mike]

Dr g

Camels and donkeys are not small, do you really need a variable why not check out a good fixed 4, 6 or 7 power. The woble factor with the bigger power scopes increases dramatically if you haven't got a good rest. Have a look at Lynx, Meopta etc.

Mike

[zzsstt]

I can land a Leupold VX-III 8.5-25x50mm at my door, ex the U.S. for just over $AU1K

Remember that if you get above $1000AU (including freight) they will hit you with GST, import duties etc etc

[zzsstt]

An interesting fact is that Leopolds are the single most returned scopes in the world as far as warranty goes. It is also a fact that Leupolds are assembled in the same factories as all the other brands.

They are probably also one of the top selling brands, and remember that they have a lifetime warranty. Most companies only offer a year, so if ALL their scopes failed after 14 months they would still be able to claim they have no warranty returns.

By the way, not wishing to sound negative about any other companies, but I'd rather have a lifetime warranty from a company that has been in existence for 100 years (and is likely to remain in business for a good while longer) than from a new company. If the company is not in business in a years time the warranty is useless. The only exception to this is those companies who take out an insurance company backed warranty, such that any repair costs would be paid by the insurance company in the case of the manufacturer going out of business. I have not seen this in relatively inexpensive items like scopes, however.

As far as where Leupolds are made, I really have no idea. Bit I DO know from personal experience that one production line can happily make tight tolerance, high quality product for one customer and the following week use cheap components and make low quality, low cost gear for another.

[HiWall]

I can land a Leupold VX-III 8.5-25x50mm at my door, ex the U.S. for just over $AU1K

Remember that if you get above $1000AU (including freight) they will hit you with GST, import duties etc etc

I know they can do this, but have never met anyone who has actually been made to cough up - even with GST etc it would probably only come to a couple of hundred dollars so would maybe only save 6 or 7 hundred on the price of the $1900 local bought product.

[Rinso]

zzsstt,

Mate I am not going to argue the toss with you ... my comment about Leupolds being the most returned is a simple fact .. no more no less.

... Either way your entitled to your opinion ...

As far as warranty goes .... I could sit here and name you a heap of Australian brand goods which were in business for 100 yrs and are now long gone, so what. I hope you dont buy stuff just because the companies been around for a while, because that has no bearing on quality, service or expected life of goods or company.

After all Winchester Centrefire Rilfes were around for over 100 years ... they don't make them anymore do they ????

Dont get up tight ...

By the way I stand by my statement Vortex is quality gear ..... and good value for money.

HiWall,
The review is all but complete and I hope to post early next week at the latest .. I need a proof reader .. you interested .. send me you e-mail by pm.

cheers
Rinso

[bushchook]

Given that you have had good experience with the Bushnell Elite 3200 I suggest you go to the 4200 . I have one , several top of the range Leupolds and 2 Meoptas . Have had a top of the range Burris that caused problems .
I think the Elite 4200 is probably the best value for money around at the moment - even when bought locally .
The Vortex may prove to be great but at the moment their resale value would be what ?

[Rinso]

bushchook,

Yes the 3200 & 4200 are good scopes but I am sure the Optic Zone prices will be best will the dollar is high. Dont think either would be a bad choice.

cheers
Rinso

[ogre6br]

another possible option

these guys are part of optic zone

http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=2248313

LAter
p

[zzsstt]

zzsstt,

Mate I am not going to argue the toss with you ... my comment about Leupolds being the most returned is a simple fact .. no more no less.

... Either way your entitled to your opinion ...

As far as warranty goes .... I could sit here and name you a heap of Australian brand goods which were in business for 100 yrs and are now long gone, so what. I hope you dont buy stuff just because the companies been around for a while, because that has no bearing on quality, service or expected life of goods or company.

After all Winchester Centrefire Rilfes were around for over 100 years ... they don't make them anymore do they ????

Dont get up tight ...

By the way I stand by my statement Vortex is quality gear ..... and good value for money.
cheers
Rinso

Don't worry, I'm pretty hard to offend! I have no doubt the Vortex scopes are good, and if they are as good as Leupold then they are priced very well. As far as warranty return numbers go, if you offer an unconditional lifetime warranty, sell a lot of product and stay in business you will inevitably get a lot of returns. Everything fails eventually and if it is still under warranty it will be sent back for repair. Hopefully Vortex will be in business long enough to find that out for themselves.

I don't buy because a company has been in business for 100 years, and I know companies come and go. However it is also a fact that more companies fail in their early stages than when they have become established - hence I don't put all my faith in a lifetime warranty from a new company.

I am interested in how you know that Leupolds are the most returned scopes, or that they are made in a non-USA factory, as from what I have read on the 'net there is much speculation but no solid facts. Leupold have alledgedly removed the "made in USA" stamp from their low end scopes, but say this is only because they source lenses from other companies - they say the scopes are still assembled in their US factory. I am sure they don't publicise their warranty returns figures either!

I also believe that the 'net has a magnifying effect. A small number of people who have a problem with a product, or simply regret their purchase for some reason, can cause a product or manufacturer to get a bad rep very quickly. I have no doubt that there are those who have had bad experiences with Leupold, but I suspect there are far far more who are totally happy with their scopes. This applies obviously to all manufacturers, for example I noticed a round of Burris bashing some while ago. Personally I have a couple of Leupold scopes that I am perfectly happy with. On the other hand I have a Lynx scope that I don't really like. I don't think that it has anything wrong with it, and I don't think Lynx, or their scopes are all bad, I just don't like this one. It does the job, but I don't enjoy it as much as some other scopes. Some people swear by them and say they are better than everything else. Maybe I have a bad one, or maybe it just doesn't suit me, who knows?

Either way, at some point I'd like to look at a Vortex scope to see what the fuss is about!

[Rinso]

zzsstt,

Vortex began in the mid-80's when the Hamilton family moved to Wisconsin

So they have been about for a while in optics, just not in riflescopes.
Yes Leupold have been around for a long while and as you say that may be the reason they have the returns they have.

I am not, however the only person having issues with Leupolds of late. If you have been around the 'net' you will be aware that numerous statements have been made regards the high number of scopes coming out of the factory with canted reticles (look before you buy is the rule here).

On the Vortex is better than Leupold I will not make a large comment except to say, that I have tested 1 Vortex scope against a Leupold VXIII and can't see a difference in lens quality .. but thats only my opinion and by no means is it law.

I believe that Vortex are better value for money than Leupold at the moment .. that may change down the track.

I don't buy because a company has been in business for 100 years, and I know companies come and go.

I realise that mate, it was too good to pass that one up.

As far as US made well they have removed the US made for one reason they source parts from elsewhere ... guess where they get them ..yep the same factories everyone else use's ... as far as return go they have to report all sorts of things to all sorts of agencies mate .. you just have to kow where to look.

Either way, at some point I'd like to look at a Vortex scope to see what the fuss is about!

If your near Bathurst or anywhere else I travel to shooting I would gladly let you drool over the test unit I have ... I would say there is no fuss in my mind about Vortex .. They will sink or swim on merit .. I believe they will swim personnally. I suggest them to people when its appropriate mainly because I am one of the few here who have had a look though one.

I do not however suggest them when its not appropriate ie for target work or when someone wants something cheaper or something that Vortex don't supply.

I currently own 2 Leupold VXIII's 6.5-20, 1 Leupold 36 x 40 and just sold a 24 x 40. I have a 12 x and 3-9 VXI somewhere .. so don't go thinking I have it in for Leupold they make a good product .. most of the time but its just not right for everyone or every situation. Weaver and Sightron make some good scopes and I have recommended different folks to them as well.

I just think that the Vortex gear is up to the standard and is good value for money and when you look at the introductory offers going they are dam hard to go past ... 3-9 scopes $100 below RRP is pretty sweet and gets AusVarmit members into a quality scope for a very good price.

cheers
Rinso

[Dr G]

Thanks for the input guys

HiWall, i will certainly have a look at the Nikons thanks for the heads up.

Mike, i had considered a fixed power early on and i suspect a variable would not be necessary if it was only for donkeys and camels but i hope to have a play with some lighter grain varmint rounds and see how it goes as a long distance cat gun. For this the variable will come into its own and the 4-12 or 4.5-14 would probably be best.

Bushchook, the bushnells are still under consideration but as i said to trevort i would like to try something a bit different. I would have no hesitation recomending a bushnell elite series scope to anyone based on the one i have. They are great value optics

Ogre6br, i have read some good reports on the Clearridge scopes as well, so many brands. This is one of the reasons i posted this question. When you cant get to a shop to look through them you really need to rely on the experience of others.

Thanks again guys this wont be an easy choice but i suspect i will be happy one once it's made

[trevort]

Dr G, I just bought one of the new 4200 side focus models, 6-24 x50 for my fireball so the 100m rabbit looks like he's about to jump into my lap!

The thing is heavy but these new ones are in a much more compact tube. Its at least an inch shorter than my VX111 6.5x 20.

If you had it on 6 it would be wide enough field of view for a hunting rifle and the cats should be nervous when its wound up. I havent met you but you look like a reasonable sized bloke in the photos, maybe a heavier scope wouldn't be an issue and then maybe again it would upset the rifle balance but physical dimensions it wont look out of place due to the short tube.

Just another option.

[zzsstt]

zzsstt,

On the Vortex is better than Leupold I will not make a large comment except to say, that I have tested 1 Vortex scope against a Leupold VXIII and can't see a difference in lens quality .. but thats only my opinion and by no means is it law.

cheers
Rinso

I've never heard of a company having to report warranty returns, and I've owned companies in both hemispheres. Maybe the US is different, I worked there for a couple of years but I never owned a manufacturing company.

I just want to confirm, when you say you have tested the Vortex against a VX-III, you do mean a VX-III, not a Vari-X III as the two are NOT the same.

As I have said before, the VX-III is a far superior product to the Vari-X III which, for example, does not have index matched lenses. The VX-III scopes have "up to" (don't you love marketing!) 98% total light transmission which is significantly higher than the Vari-X III's and even the Vortex range which quote 95% on their web site. I know I keep saying this but I want to be sure, because the review started off saying Vari-X III (as the one you had for sale) and then changed to VX-III part way through. That would be like comparing a car against an original Mini and calling it the BMW built "new" Mini.

Anyway, I'm only about an hour from you. Next time I have need to travel to Bathurst I'll let you know and hopefully I can get a look at the Vortex.

Cheers!

[Tempo]

Dr G, I have a Clearidge 4.5-14 x 40 Ultra XP on my .17 HMR cost $429.00 and a Weaver Grand Slam 6.5-20 x40 on my .223 cost $477.00. I got both of them from the Optic Zone. My budget was a scope for around $500. If my budget was higher I guess I would have also looked at other options. That said, I can not fault either scope and they suit my needs very well. However, the Clearidge does have high target style turrents which may not suit your application ie on a quad bike in a scabbard. So many good scopes around making choice difficult