Which Rifles: Can you please help - Now have PROPERTY LETTER

[Dancing Bears]

Hi All,

Thanks for all of your input on my last post. A quick update on my situation for you.

I have now secured a property letter from a friend to shoot on their 8000 acre property in the wheatbelt, where goats, foxes, rabbits and pigs are all plentiful at different times. This will give me the opportunity to do a little more serious shooting and not upset the neigbours as much. Importantly this also introduces a number of options that had been previously ruled out due to the relatively small size of my own 120 acre block at Benger (WA). I believe options that have previously been mentioned such as .223 right up to say .308 cals are now in play.

Of course this has simply served to confused me even further.

So, with the same parameters as previously (small to medium varmints and large animal stock destruction), with the addition of the property letter, what does the brains trust now think?

Question: If you had to take just 3 rifles with you, which one's would they be? and why?

Thanks again for sharing your collective experience and wisdom,

Dancing Bears

[MISSED]

If it were my choice for three rifles to take they would be the 25/30.06, Twenty five ought six and 25/06 just pulling your leg

My three would be a 22 using subs for practice and bunnies up close and personel
222 for some medium range bunny splatting and foxes under the light and because it is not a 223.
And a 25/06 for everything you have listed and because it is not a 243

[James270]

If it were my choice for three rifles to take they would be the 25/30.06, Twenty five ought six and 25/06 just pulling your leg

My three would be a 22 using subs for practice and bunnies up close and personel
222 for some medium range bunny splatting and foxes under the light and because it is not a 223.
And a 25/06 for everything you have listed and because it is not a 243

I didnt know you had come out of the closet mate

Seriously, I would recommend a 22 with Winchester Power Points; because subs are for pussies
223 for a bit more legs and because MISSED doesnt like them.
270/308 for the bigger stuuf because of ammo availability



P.S. Above advice is a guide only and any prospective purchasers should consult the Product Disclosure Statement before any investment decisions are made

[doidge5781]

Going on what you are shooting i'd have a .22 and a 6.5mm something .260 rem,6.5x55,6.5 creedmoor or grendel any of these loaded with 100gr BT bullets will smash foxes,goat and pigs use the money saved from buying a 3rd gun to buy a decent scope and sh@tloads of ammo and practice

[cruisey]

I know you specified rifles bear, but if you are new to shooting I would keep it simple for the game you stated.

.22
12 gauge
.222

and you will be right

[Ackley Improved]

22lr/scattergun
223
308

[Camel]

James270, has the perfect answer, the three will cover anything you will run into from your list you gave us. All three are easily obtained and they run the best range of ammo going, price wise as well as availability. Every shop that sells ammo has got those three covered. They are the three rifles I use for my professional shooting.

[Sam Walker]

22LR, 222 or 223, choose a 3rd bigger cal when you have some more experience, 243, 260, or 308 - any of those will bowl pigs.

The 243 some say is a bit light for big, mud encrusted boars but is ample for goats, roos, and can double as a varmint rifle with 60-70 gn bullets.

A 308 will be ample for any size pig, but kicks harder,,,,260 is probably a nice compromise but ammo will not be as easy to find away from gunshops. All 3 are based on the same cartridge BTW

A Hornet would be great for use at Benger ( I used to live over at Binningup) but is really a cartridge for the handloader (factory ammo is exxy) so a 222 would be better. The plods won't come at the idea of a 222 shooting on 120 acres but your property letter will be ample to cover your need for a small and medium CF.

If you know you're keen on handloading in the future this could influence your calibre choices a bit, most people get into handloading a couple of years after they get going hunting/shooting. It's a lot to outlay at the start but pays for itself in the long run

edited to make more sense

[bigfellascott]

For me it would depend to some degree on whether you are going to be reloading or not? If you are just buying factory ammo with no intention of reloading I'd go the 223 and 308 as ammo availability is usually good, a 22 would also be good for the bunnies if you want to eat them.

If you are going to reload, your options are pretty much endless, depending on projectile, case, primer, powder availablity. For mine I would learn to reload and choose the cals you like instead of being dictated to by ammo availability.

There are lots of great cals out there that are capable of handling all the ferals you have described.

The humble 22 is great for the rabbits and practicing - cheap to feed.

For foxes and roos the 22.250 or 204 are great cals and will also handle pigs

For Pigs and anything bigger the 308 has always done the job well but there are lots of big cals that are up to the job 243, 270, 308, 7mm, 7/08 you name it plus a heap of others, you've got to choose what one you would like to own and go from there, they are all capable of handling pigs etc

Good luck with your choice

[Dancing Bears]

Thanks all for the feedback - please keep it coming.

Reloading - as with the previous post a friend will reload for me if I require it or it is more cost effective to do so (i think it costs about a carton of beer).

At this stage I'm leaning towards
.22LR
.223
.308
12g is a given which is why I would prefer to eliminate this from the discussion at this point.

Somebody that I respect has put a different option to me as follows:

17HMR - covers the short and longer range (150m) varmint shooting. Still cheap enough to plink with and very accurate for a rimfire
.270 or 7mm - covers the pigs and longer shots
30/30 - great for the stock destruction work around yards and scrub

I'm not sure about the last point, or whether the .270 is really going to fill the gap of the .223. Then again I suppose that there are going to be "gaps" whatever I do.

Anyway would appreciate your feedback on the respective combo's and now that we seem to be getting somewhere your objective views regarding suitable make and model in each respective calibre.

Thanks,

[Camel]

Have found over the last 37 years that I have been shooting and 35 reloading, the best is to keep it simple. Get the best gear you can at the time and it will look after you as much as you look after it. Dont buy the top of the range and dont buy the bottom thinking you will save money, you might in the short term but later on you hear about how this shoots better than that, and then its round the mulberry bush. I think most of us have done this, I know I did.
If you are just generally shooting and arent tied up in target shooting, you cannot go past the three calibres that I mentioned in last post.
They may be as common as dog shit, but there is a reason why. They have stood the test of time because they do the job they were designed to do perfectly. All three are available anywhere, as said earlier.
If you want to go into reloading then you can get bits and pieces over a time and build up your gear as you need it. I started my reloading with a couple of Lee loader kits, they are very cheap and make great ammo for hunting if you take your time and do eveerything they tell you in the instructions. Later on you can get press dies and all other stuff we seem to fine a "need" for as your shooting progresses.
If your mate will do the reloading for you, and he has the press and scales, things like that, then all you have to do is get some reloading dies, powder, primers and projectiles you wish to use and go for it. Its a great way to spend a bit of time with mates and load and test your own ammo. Thats another thing all the loading gear for 308 and 223 are readily available and cheap compared to some of the specialist cartridges.

The big thing is dont try and find the magic gun/cartridge that will do everything, it hasnt been invented yet.
My personal preference is CZ453 22lr. Varmint. Sako 75 223, and Brno 601 308 (oldie but goody) Put good mid range priced scopes on them, and then go and enjoy the shooting.

[Dancing Bears]

Camel, Sage advice from someone who has been around the block before!

Thanks for trying to get me up to speed and avoid making the same mistakes.

I agree with your points of keeping it simple, and that there is no "one size fits all calibre" so better to not to even try.

Also agree that sticking to the more common widely used calibre makes sense and maximises choice. Interestingly the majority of the feedback through the forum seems to gravitate towards 3 or 4 tried and trued calibres. Having said that the very accurate and flat shooting .17HMR and 7mm cartridges appear to making serious enrodes in popularity / market share.

Whilst price is not really a factor in my decision making process, I have shortlisted Sako 75 Varmint in .223 (or possibly even the 85) as being a rifle worth owning. I have also been impresed by a couple of the Browning's I have looked at (X bolt Hunter and A bolt Eclipse in 7mm or .308). I consider these mid-range in price with quality fit and finish. Spending money on good scopes also makes plenty of sense, though most importantly I do not under-estimate the importance of simply spending the time "getting to know" each rifle (as well as myself) and how to get the most out of each.

I would love to hear everybody's thoughts so please keep the comment coming - particularly around the alterate idea of the 17HMR, 7mm and 30-30 combo (particularly since these calibres haven't been raised in the mainstream of popular opinion thus far)

Cheers,

[Camel]

Evening Dancing Bears, U sure you not American Indian with a name like that. Mate reason I dont suggest 17hmr is just the cost of ammo, I cant put shit on it as I have one myself and think its a fantastic little gun, another CZ453. The 7 mm is something that I have thought about myself but instead went for 308win for previous stated reasons. Was going to get either 7mm08 or 7x57. Again great cartridges, but for me in remote nsw getting ammo was the big problem.
I went through what a lot of blokes I know did, and that was that the one you got at the time just doesnt quite do the job you want it to. Most of that was just in the imagination and all the marketing hype that goes with firearms ownership. Man I had some good little rifles over the years, and if I really am truthful the original rem788, I got in 1981 and the Brno mod 2 with a 308 thrown in would have seen me still using them. Only got the brno 22 still out of all the ones I brought and sold over the years, only because it was the first rifle i ever bought, (there must be some sense in my thick skull after all) But as they say the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.
I know that some people have that itch that gets most of us and that is to try the next wizzbang that comes along but in the cold hard light of day if you think about it you really dont "NEED" the extra speed or .1 inch smaller group for normal hunting.
Thats just my thoughts, and most would agree, "BUT its been fun trying "
Ill get off now mate have gas bagged enough, Have fun whatever way you go.

[Dancing Bears]

Camel,

...and I guess you didn't get that name because you have a hump on your back! John Travolta I am not.

I know nothing gets close to the 8 cents or so for the .22 round, but didn't think 17 cents for the 17HMR would be a significant financial impost, particularly given the extra versatility (range and accuracy) that the round offers and that the centrefire rounds get a lot more expensive than this. check this out: http://www.langseeds.com.au/guns-a-ammunition.

$177 for a 1000 rounds is good value shooting in my book if i'm able to kock over foxes at 120m with this thing - the alternative at that distance would be the .223 at up to 5 x the price.

The 17HMR seems to provide so much reach so as to perhaps eliminate the need (and therefore cost) of me running 2 x centrefires (.223 and .308) in addition to the "plinking" 22LR.

This is where my friend was coming from with a .17HMR + .270, 7mm or .308 for the varmints up to and including pigs at 200 yards, and the 30-30 for the close range stock destruction work. He said that the long barrel rifles can be a problem in yards, and that most vets over here still use this calibre as their preferred method for destroying horses and cattle humanely. The 30-30 is also handy for the short range pigs in heavy scrub where a clear shot is difficult (note we have 8 acres of bush along an irrigational channel which is where the pigs move through our property and might be difficult to get a clear shot away with the high powered rifles.

I know 30-30's aren't recognised as "the go" for serious hunting/accuracy, though they do seem to be a very versatile and practical option for my small farm that can be easily licensed.

Will just 1 centrefire in the 270 to 308 range suffice?

[17hmr]

with 8000 acres and no boundaries of money id go a .22 to pop bunnies in something like a cz or browning. a .204 for long range bunnies, hares, foxes, dogs, small pigs. and something like a .408cheytac to blow pigs away at over a km