Rimfire accuracy

[Ron Goulding]

Weighing your ammo will only make you feel more confident it wont take out the flyers. To all of you who thinks weighing will make a differance , try this exercise. Take a pkt of your best ammo and weigh them then take ten at random and pull them apart and weigh everything seperately , Projectiles , powder and cases. Ive had some that the cases weighed differantly and the powder was differant and projectiles etc but put together weighed exactly the same. Its out of your hands only the benchrest gods know if its an x ring or a nine. Save your time and weigh a house brick and then smack yourself in the forehead for thinking you can make a differance as this stuff in manufacture many thousands of miles away by some prick who proberly gets enjoyment with F@#*king with our heads by putting flyers in every pkt ! Cheers Ron

[chris.tyne]

Thanks Ron,you have snapped me out of the idea of weighing ammo..................................I would rather have slithers of bamboo inserted under my nails than weigh a brick.....................or hit a brick or something like that.






Regards Chris.

[native hunter]

Mornin all,
If it only achieves confidence then its done its job.!!
I even weighed some ammo last night(Eley match),basically sorted into high and lows,there was a few that were alot heavier and also some that were alot lighter than the two groups ,so i seperated them for foulers as well,only did two packets.
I will shoot them tonight at the club shoot and see what happens.
Regards
Native

[Ron Goulding]

Hi NH , cofidence will ber high as long as your hit n X rings, Just wait until you pick out that DUDD that goes at 6 o clock in the 7 ring or Worse ! Then where are you ? Go knock yourself out , im done with weighing and guage n rim thickness.
Cheers Ron

[native hunter]

G'day Ron,
I Think that most of the time people blame the ammo but in fact it was their error in not reading the conditions right.
For it to be a true flyer I would say it would have to be at least an inch or so from the rest of the group and I only say that if your setup is capable of excellent grouping.
Theres lots more than ammo factors at work,Tuning and technique are big ones, and the good ole wind.
I cannot say I have had a true flyer in(match or above) decent ammo, at the time thats what I blamed but after settling down and going thru what happened it usually comes back to shooter error.
In the last three shoots at our club I shot,200.20, 198.15(very windy rainy night),and 200.18, that was with straight out of the packet match,so if tonight i shoot a 200.17-18 or so I can pretty much say it did bugger all or was it just a bad night for me.???????
I suppose I will never know.
Regards
Native

[native hunter]

Chris,
I was just on RA and that site has gone down the tube.
Regards
Native

[chris.tyne]

Hey Damien I have followed/read some............maybe quite a bit of what Bill Calfee has posted and ...well I think he is a very good smith and also an excellent wordsmith as well.
Yes he may come across as a backwoods hick even a bit incoherent sometimes but I am sure that he is laughing into his glass at the same time.
No doubt he has/is built some great shooting rifles and aslo placed them in the hands of people that will do them justice but he is what he is and does what he does,I can appreciate his dry humour and the keeping people waiting for the next installment type writings.
I have spoken to a person that used one of DJ hepler's rifles in Italy and the comment was that it was unbelievably accurate and it was built by Bill,having said that we also turn full circle in that I would bet my life that the ammo was cherry picked out of a massive lot to suit it as well.



Regards Chris.

[native hunter]

Chris,
You are dead right about that.!!
Calfee loves to stir the pot and then let everyone else scrap over it.
Regards
native

[Tony Z]

Chris you are also dead right about the ammo being cherry picked. Personally i reckon Calfee is let out for the weekend into his machine shop and then locked away in a cell to come down off some pretty serious drugs. Meanwhile his nurse listens and types his rambling.

Native, if it is true in what you say, then you will be the first to agree with me when i say that the next biggest advancement in rimfire shooting will be the development of a great wind flag. I have said this for years and still believe it to be true. "Don't build me a better rifle, build me a better wind flag".

[native hunter]

Tony,
Funny you should say that as Over the past months I have thought about how it would be good to have a flag with a large illuminated LED readout for wind speed/direction and a red and green light, I know im dreaming but thats what rimfire does to us.!!
I also have been hearing reports how the new winchester sub 42 grn hollowpoint is very accurate for what it is and wondered if target ammo will go down the heavier projectile path again, maybe a grain or two, like winchester.
Anyway I suppose we wait and just keep trying new ideas and techniques to see what emerges, but as I have said in a previous post, how good do we expect it to get.????
Regards
native

[Rabbitz]

...how it would be good to have a flag with a large illuminated LED readout for wind speed/direction and a red and green light, I know im dreaming ...

Doesn't sound that difficult to put together. Although I wouldn't use a numerical readout, I would use a graph matrix. The algorithm might be fun to nut out though.

The question is, would it be within the rules?

Rabz

[shane]

I can say from experiance that weighting out rimfire ammo into batches will improve your aggs. However it depends on the target you are shooting as to weather or not you will notice the improvement. eg group v's ATR etc
cheers,
Shane

[Brett33]

I have spoken to a person that used one of DJ hepler's rifles in Italy and the comment was that it was unbelievably accurate and it was built by Bill,having said that we also turn full circle in that I would bet my life that the ammo was cherry picked out of a massive lot to suit it as well.
Regards Chris.

Most of the Aus team that went to Italy are shooting buddies and I hear all the stories about that comp and the gear. And I think it is true that great equipment (Calfee built rifles) helped but our World champ from that comp on his day is a step above the rest of the field in Australia. What is worse he now claims to have a barrel / ammo / smith combination that is as good as DJ's rifle that he won with. Look out when he turns up to a comp with it, thankfully he is saving it for big International shoots.
Not certain the USA guys get to cherry pick ammo, certainly not like the Europeans, their team are Eley sponsered and get to go to the factory and cherry pick for the World titles.

Brett

[chris.tyne]

Brett I think we are talking about different people cause the person I was refering to is a .................................lovely lady ,I have to disagree (silly I know cause I have no idea) about team USA not having at least access to the cream of the crop or at least all of the crop to test...................................pretty sure Bob Collins or the like would have them sorted.........................to some extent.
Brett I just realized that I misunderstood what you were saying and yes I hear that Mr A's shit is sorted. ...............who is his Smith .





Regards Chris.

[Brett33]

Native, if it is true in what you say, then you will be the first to agree with me when i say that the next biggest advancement in rimfire shooting will be the development of a great wind flag. I have said this for years and still believe it to be true. "Don't build me a better rifle, build me a better wind flag".

If only I had the money and time a better wind flag is possible, not certain it would fit in the rules because it would be electronic and computer based. The only problem is the humans ability to process large amounts of information, means we can make a decision and react better then any computer program could do.
However the system I would like to build would have 3 ultrasonic 3 deminsion wind sensors, recording 30 times a second, averaged and sent to a laptop via blue tooth every second. What it would look like on the computer is the hard bit, with the equipment sending back wind speed, horizontal wind and vertical wind at 3 points on the range 3 picture graphs on the screen telling the story would be best.

Brett
Blurb about wind sensors
When averaged over time, ultrasonic and mechanical measurement accuracies are comparable. Both report the level of accuracy according to sensor’s published specifications. Although data is accurate when averaged, mechanical sensors will not always reflect turbulence (rapid changes in wind speed and direction) and gusts due to the simple physical limitations of its moving parts. A mechanical sensor is affected by the start-up torque of the moving cup and vane. Observed differences occur in measured wind speed because of the time it takes a mechanical sensor to physically start up or register a change in wind direction. For example, if a storm blows through an area and the wind suddenly changes direction, the sensor must slow, stop, and restart with the change in wind direction. It will take some seconds to register and report the change.
In contrast, an ultrasonic sensor is not affected its inertia. It will measure a change in wind direction or a high gust immediately and in real time.
Three-D sensors are used where more precise measurement of wind activity is required. Three-D sensors are common in meteorological research and for small-scale flow measurements in a lab.