AusVarmint

I saw a post on a Facebook reloading page where old mate posted the powder charge and node quickload states for his outfit. I commented that nothing substitutes for doing your own development and another operator chimes in with the opinion that you look it up on quickload and that is it.

I thought it would be good at giving you starting loads and indicating the best powder etc but not to be treated as the answer and replacement for doing your own load development.

Am I wrong? What does the software distributor say? Do they purport to be the loading gospel?


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Facebook, the new reality

Well I have only one experience with quickload and it gave me a powder and range to work with.

I think there are too many variables to take it as gospel.

Trev,

Cover your arse mate, quickload doesn't know that the barrel is a lump of junk from Tobler and is 1.6thou undersize, or that the punters scales are out of whack. Give them a starting number, then hunker down behind something solid and let them work up, it's much safer for you, and them too!!

Jeff

Don’t fuck with the gene pool Trev. It looks like quick load is sorting it out at the shallow end for you.


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justjeff wrote:Trev,

Cover your arse mate, quickload doesn't know that the barrel is a lump of junk from Tobler and is 1.6thou undersize, or that the punters scales are out of whack. Give them a starting number, then hunker down behind something solid and let them work up, it's much safer for you, and them too!!

Jeff

Jeff I don’t have it or use it. Just wanting you guys to back me up thinking our Facebook reload tyro is a dick


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Rod Davies wrote something interesting about this not long ago and the variation in speed between different batches.
Now think back to Rod firing round after round of different batches of 2208 at Williams to work out the amount of adjustment needed to get the same velocity.
In essence it is only relevant to what you are expecting to achieve,
Rod wants to hit the same 20cent piece from 50-1000 and old mate may only want to shoot buff at 50m requiring the accuracy of an 8 inch dinner plate.
You also need to consider what he is used to shooting. If Kickinback goes up half a grain in his vartarg it’s a 2.8% and massive change in a 338 lap or rum it may be less than 1/2% and change little so be close enough to not change his dinner plate accuracy.
Ask old mate if 1 load suits all why do reload manuals have min and max loads?


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kickinback wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:07 pm Don’t fuck with the gene pool Trev. It looks like quick load is sorting it out at the shallow end for you.


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+ fuckloads

justjeff wrote: ↑Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:55 pm SNIP...........
quickload doesn't know that the barrel is a lump of junk from Tobler and is 1.6thou undersize.

Jeff

Happy to take this to PM Jeff,
You know something to back this up?

It's good, but also makes numerous assumptions. I love playing with it to see what's potentially possible, but nothing beats actually loading and chronographing.
Cheers...
Con

Con wrote:It's good, but also makes numerous assumptions. I love playing with it to see what's potentially possible, but nothing beats actually loading and chronographing.
Cheers...
Con

Con do the instructions or disclaimers with the software make any claim that it is the ‘source of truth’ and does away with the need for doing your own load development?


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Trev, I don't have or use Quickload, but in the past have had a friend in Alaska run quite a few loads through it for me. Therefore my thoughts below reflect my understanding on that basis.

Qyickload is a predictor. Like any predictor it relies on input variables and assumptions.The accuracy of the prediction is dependant on how good those input variables and assumptions are.

At times this is then dependant on how detailed/anal the operator is, and the precision of their equipment.

A couple of examples:

My understanding is that QL requires the volumetric capacity of the cartridge case that you intend to load for. This of course depends on the seating depth of the projectile, but is also depends on the make of the case. At one end of the scale you could just use a generic capacity for the case your loading (say a .22-250), and just use calipers to measure the length of your 50gn SP, and then measure the OAL of a loaded round. Obviously there are a few opportunities for errors/variations in this approach. At the other end of the scale you might trim your cases all to the same length, weight sort, then select 5 or 10 cases and with a dead primer seated weight each one, then fill each one with water to be level at the neck and weigh again. Convert the weight of water in each case to a volumetric capacity. With your projectiles use a technique that doesn't rely on the soft point (which of course could vary) as a datum for measurement.

Playing around with these variables within QL is not beyond anyone who has a decent set of scales and calipers/micrometer, and the inclination and ability to use them.

Another example is powder burn rate. My understanding is within QL there is a list of different powders with an associated assumed burn rate, but that there is an option to modify this burn rate variable to reflect lot-to-lot variations. I suspect that unless you are a Rod Davies, Tony Z or DG this is one area of QL the vast majority of us would never play around with.

As with everything in life (and notes in a previous post above) the effort you put in should reflect the outputs you are after. As a predictor tool QL can reduce the time and components used for load testing through providing a range to work within, but it doesn't replace load testing.

Marcus

Trevor,
There are certainly warnings!! Mostly regarding powder burn rate variations.
Cheers...
Con

Sounds like Quickload is very good parametric model.

As with all models they are by definition a simplification of reality and thus can't take into account every aspect of the REAL WORLD. Hence you shouldn't bet your life on the output of a simplified reality.

A wise person named Monty Python summed it up rather nicely: It's only a model!

I bet the fine print for Quickload absolves itself of any responsibility for what people may do with it. Just like the projectile, primer, powder manufacturers do.

Out of all the loads i have put through QL and then over a chrono, only 1 or 2 times has it been spot on. Most of the time its 50-200fps out. There is the ability to fine tune powder rates so you can match it to you batch but i have never done that. I did read where a guy did 2-3 loads with the same batch of powder and was able to adjust it to make it super close but that's way too much effort for me. You would have to change it every time you got a new batch of powder.