How much are 39grSBK's over east

[Brad Y]

40vm I havent tried, but noslers and vmax arent far behind the price of SBK's anyway here. I like the green tips, they work rather well.

[Ackley Improved]

Elks Hunting and Fishing..

39BK 20cal in stock.. price $49. They have gone up again.. so no longer $43!

Cheers

[Trev]

Geez

Dont you guys start knocking our Australian prices, you will get me in trouble again. Dont mention how all the stuff that is double in price comes from NIOA as well lol. Dont mention that two companies import Annies into the country yet on my Annie Target rifle their was a $700 price difference bewteen the two. Dont mention that our dollar is now really high yet the prices on everything is still going up lol. Even the FX3 scope I bought last week was still the same price (quote) from the LGS as it was 3 months ago, and I paid $43 less from TOZ for it than it was priced 3 months ago, 1/2 price INCLUDING SHIPPING LOL.

[GriMo]

Geez

Dont you guys start knocking our Australian prices, you will get me in trouble again. Dont mention how all the stuff that is double in price comes from NIOA as well lol. Dont mention that two companies import Annies into the country yet on my Annie Target rifle their was a $700 price difference bewteen the two. Dont mention that our dollar is now really high yet the prices on everything is still going up lol. Even the FX3 scope I bought last week was still the same price (quote) from the LGS as it was 3 months ago, and I paid $43 less from TOZ for it than it was priced 3 months ago, 1/2 price INCLUDING SHIPPING LOL.

Care to show exact prices as to where your sourcing that pricing information, on specific products from the same manufacturers with the same deals between US Distributors and AUS Distributors? Or are you just talking shit again? Whats that, you not privvy to that information? Wow, and here i was thinking you werent just blowing the same old tune again...

Funnily enough i wasn't aware Nioa were distributors for Sierra, you know, the brand that is currently under focus for the pricing of their pills. IE the SMK and SBK.
Also you could bitch and moan to Herron who also distribute in Hornady pills, you know the other brand everyone is bitching about in this thread for the price rise. Maybe even have a go at the mining companies etc, how dare they make copper more expensive. the BASTARDS.

There's a guy on here, his names Sean, I think you and he would get along really well. Could sit around the campfire making Tin Foil hats while talking about big corporation(s) out to get the little guy.

[kjd]

Out of everything projectile prices are what concerns me the most. Sure pay more for a scope etc etc but you get to keep that for years and years if you like (unless you are a habitual scope buying addict like Trev no offence mate you just buy a shit tonne of scopes). Projectiles are a one shot thing. They are very expensive over here and you can get them cheaper from the US.
That said why is it that all projectile prices are pretty much even over here per quality. I mean surely if a distributor could still make a decent amount of money and undercut their competitors by a reasonable amount they would wouldn't they? So wheres the increase come from? I don't know. I really don't.
I don't think any of us here are qualified to answer my question either. Only way to really know is to bring in your own projectiles from the states on a commercial basis and try to make some money from them...

[wifecallsmegrumpy]

Ok so I can get the SBK’s in 39/204 from
http://www.natchezss.com/bullets.cfm?co ... etWeight=0

For $19 US per box. @ .92 for conversion to AUD = $20.65

Let’s consider that’s the best price that an international distributor would get them for, probably less but that’s the starting point.

Let’s also consider we would purchase 5000 packs of 100bullets as a minimum order.

Each pack weighs about 500grams, so that’s 2500kg’s so it’s a seafreight order for sure. Hopefully the supplier will ship them to our export port (LA) and pay for the export paperwork, Bills of Lading . So for this calculation consider the terms Free on Board (Fob)

Freight cost from the US to East Coast Australia is cheap about $150 cbm/tonne but it’s the add ons that kill you.
Freight US$ 375
Terminal Handling Charge US$162.50
Export docs etc – Free
Delivery to Port - Free
Total US$ 537.50 or AUD 584.23
Customs clearance $150
Seacargo automation $65
Port Service $137.50
Documentation fee $70
Delivery $150
Total $1156.73

Plus GST $10,325 Plus duty if required.

So far that makes it
Original cost of Bullets $ 103250
Shipping $1156.73
GST $10,325
=114731
=$22.94 per box

So if your buying quantity you can do the shipping for about $2 per box.
Add another $2 if the exchange rate weakens back to 72c

Also consider the costs associated with employing administration people to handle the ordering, coordination, warehousing and distribution of orders from distributor to gunstores. Add another $2 per box.

What about profit ? What is the normal margin for reloading components. Add $8 profit for the distributor

New cost $34.94
Add all the costs and profit again for the gunshop. Say $8 a box.

New cost $42.94

So in summary I would say the pricing’s about right, with some potential for slight gouging by stores depending on location and competition.

Also consider that if you didn’t have $100k lying around to purchase 500000 bullets, the lower the quantity the higher the shipping price will be.

Anyone want to start a bullet importing business ?

N.B. These are estimates and I did this for fun based on my experience, so if I have a number wrong don’t get your knickers in a knot, run your own pricing model and let’s see it.

[kjd]

Great post grumpy. An eye opener thats for sure.

[gigitt]

hmmm... 2 months ago I paid $36 or $38 per 100.

i need to save some pesos to buy more if they are only going up!

[wifecallsmegrumpy]

I don't know if they will go up. My costing was on the back of a US price per box.

The component prices Copper and Lead are still lower than the peaks but would only account for about 40% of the cost, and the other cost inputs, labour, commercial real estate and the cost of finance are at all time lows in the US and for the short term.

For me prices seem to be affected in times of shortages, I am sure that Sierra runs batches of these and once out well... that's it until the next batch run which could be 6 months away.

Also Highland (Only Australian Distributor) offers discounts on sales volume so can set prices for stores to encourage sales as required, just the same as Coles and Woollies. I suspect Highland take a fair wack of profit themselves, and meek out the discounts to gunshops as they see fit. It's my understanding that Sierra and most bullet manufacturers do not sign sole distributor agreements with Australian Agents and if you had the inclination you could start up an import and distributor business to challange them and lower prices.

Even better get someone to make locally produced bullets in 204 !!

[Trev]

Grumpy
Your post is good but its completly incorrect

I know because we bring out a seacon once a month

Your charges are close but you forget one thing, that frieght charge all up doesnt get distributed among the projectiles. Its distributed among the full container load which consists of scopes, rifles, reloading gear, Knives, slings, packs, glasses, gun cases etc etc. Do you really think that they bring in a container with just projectiles.

And grimo ya wanker, did I say Sierra projectiles, no I didnt, I said Leupold and Anshutz

I purchased a Annie 6 weeks ago, was $1395 from the dealer who isnt supplied by NIOA, Elks who are supplied by NIOA couldnt do that exact rifle for $1795. Why can I buy a Nightforce scope in Australia for a very similar price to the US, Why is Ziess scopes only about $100 more than the US price.

Why is my Leupold that turns up in a week $900 cheaper that the best price in Australiaand guess what, the people I got the scope from are not an Authorised Vendor, they just buys scopes like our dealers here, are you guys saying the people bringing in Nightforce, Anshutz and Ziess dont incur the same costs. Why is the ACCC investigating the Microsoft distributor in Australia for a %50 price jump to what US customers are saying. The ACCC have said that even with duties and costs etc etc, the price should not be that much.

You admin guys are in bed with NIOA, YOU SHOULD SEE MY PM's that I get laughing about how you guys jump when someone knocks NIOA.
yOU THINK i KNOW NOTHING, WE BRING IN ONE CONTAINER A MONTH FROM THE SATES WITH $300,000 WORTH OF SUPPLIES, AND THE DISTRIBUTOR CAN ADD HIS COSTS, WAREHIOSING ETC ETC AND STILL SELL THE STUFF AT A SIMILAR PRICE TO THE STATES..
THE DISTRIBUTOR HAS 38 PEOPLE WORKING FOR HIM, HAS TWO WAREHOUSES
THE DIFFERENCE IS HE HAS OPPOSITION

[wifecallsmegrumpy]

Always ready to be corrected Trev, and as you are the fount of knowledge when it comes to all things international trade, logistics, supply chain, freight forwarding and multi tier distributor to supplier relationships I humbly bow before you and your one container a month.

My quote for Sierra's was based on what you would have to do to compete against Highland, the current distributor and how the costs are structured. If you wanted to fill up the container with something else and get a FCL (Full container load) rate then yes your freight cost would be lower, but you would need the right mix of products as the bottom of the container might fall out if you just put in projectiles.
I wouldn't expect a massive saving though.

I am not going to try to tackle the middle part of your post as I don't understand it, or if there is a question but I would be interested in understanding why you bring something in from the US, add all your costs to it and then sell it for the same price as they do in the US ? Are you saying that there are competing products made locally and you take a smaller margin just to stay in the market ?

It's obvious that we don't have a great deal of competitive tension in the Australian Firarms industry, and the public are going to be price takers, not price makers until trade restrictions between Australia and the US are lifted, enabling introduction of smaller competitors, but from my perspective that seems to be getting worse not better.

Anyway enough from me.
I am sure Admin and their Nioa masters will be along shortly to help you out. (Joking...Keithy..MAteee!)

Oh, and I was qualified to answer this post as I got an airmail letter from the US once ! LOL...

[Trev]

But Grumpy

That is the whole piont, you based projectile prices on the cost of importing a container. In that case yes you are correct. But cmon, do you think any Importer brings in a container of 5000. I can tell you they dont and they couldnt because as you pionted out the cost to import will make it expensive. A container comes in bulging at the doors as the penalty for weight is not considerable. I would bet a rifle that when NIOA bring in a container it would be stacked with a few hundred rifles, more like 500,000 assorted bullets and projectiles. a stack of scopes, then all the reloading gear. So take your freight charge and divide it by the number of items in the container and your price per item for freight is much much less.

[wifecallsmegrumpy]

Trev, I have never seen a system (Movex, SAP, JD Edwards etc.) that managed to split freight costs effectively across different products in the container. How do you do it ? Volume per item or Value per item ? You can quickly skew your average cost or Last in cost depending on which costing model your business runs.

Anyway take out the cost of shipping altogether ($2) and I still cannot find someone with their hand in the cookie jar ? Who's ripping us off ?

[kjd]

You admin guys are in bed with NIOA, YOU SHOULD SEE MY PM's that I get laughing about how you guys jump when someone knocks NIOA.
yOU THINK i KNOW NOTHING, WE BRING IN ONE CONTAINER A MONTH FROM THE SATES WITH $300,000 WORTH OF SUPPLIES, AND THE DISTRIBUTOR CAN ADD HIS COSTS, WAREHIOSING ETC ETC AND STILL SELL THE STUFF AT A SIMILAR PRICE TO THE STATES..
THE DISTRIBUTOR HAS 38 PEOPLE WORKING FOR HIM, HAS TWO WAREHOUSES
THE DIFFERENCE IS HE HAS OPPOSITION

I'll just comment on what is relevant to me.

Firstly,

I don't give a shit what people say to you about me behind my back. They are just pussies if they can't say it to our faces.

Secondly,
I never ever have pushed Nioa products. Hell I don't even have an opinion on whether you should but from Aus or not. I just don't care what you do. If I like something I will say I like it if I don't I will say I don't like it. I don't like Marlin rimfires and I don't like Weatherby Vanguard rifles they are just two examples. I do like Wolf eyes torches, ADI Powders and Nosler projectiles to name a few. Shoot me. We also don't take paid advertising on Ausvarmint forums.

Thirdly,
It isn't so much about defending any company as it is about stopping you from whining like a little girl. You never stop, you just go on and on and on and on and never do anything about your gripes.

My line is and always has been is that you can do 3 things (any or all of them):

1) If you think something wrong is going on, complain to the ACCC. You provide examples of Microsoft so why haven't you submitted a formal complaint to the ACCC about companies within the firearms industry? I mean you clearly feel hard done by and ripped off you should do something proactive about it instead of just bitching.

2) If you feel a company is not serving you well boycott their products here and overseas. Send them letters saying why you are not buying any of their products or the products of their suppliers. There are plenty of alternatives available so don't buy from said companies.

3) Go into competition with them show us all how it is done. You seem to know how to import things so set up a business put your money where you mouth is and deliver Australian shooters with good prices on all sorts of firearm related products. Create the competition you say we don't have in Aus. Hell if you think you are being ripped off you should be able to bring in all sorts of quality products, distribute them around the nation, warehouse them and advertise them whilst providing great value for Aussies and still making enough money to have a small profit and pay your employees. Shouldn't you?

I don't think any one company stands out amongst the rest I think that across the board distributors in Australia are in line with what each other are charging for comparable products. They may be expensive here but you can't single out one of the big distributors and not look at the others. I don't think they are doing that much wrong but they are all conducting a business and not a charity. That said they either are doing what they can whilst trying to be profitable and grow or they are in a mass conspiracy where they all fix prices. You be the judge but I would be the same whether you were talking about Nioa, Highland, Olin, Raytrade or Beretta etc etc.

Think what you like about me, the site and whoever else it doesn't bother me, you are just a squeeky annoying wheel when it comes to this and apart from this disagreement we have I quite like you and your posts so I don't take it all that personally. Sorry if that disappoints you.

I look forward to you addressing the contents of my post. I think you will avoid it though and play the same card you always play.

[Brad Y]

Jeez i didnt mean to start world war 3. Can i bring up something else to really get people to bite?

Ok got 500 39gr SBK's at a great price and in WA... - thanks jeff and owen.