Limit on air rifle calibres in Australia ???

[Dennis La Varenne]

Has anybody heard of any moves afoot to limit the legal calibres to not larger than .22?

This is of some concern to me after hearing what could be nothing more than alarmist gossip at a gundealer's recently. The source reckons the proposed prohibition arose from people in Australia wanting to import the very large bore PCP air rifles such as those made by Quackenbush.

I cannot see any reason to have any kind of calibre restriction as they are no more powerful than a whole range of other legal calibres and are already a licensable proposition anyway.

[Mulga]

There is always gossip and scare mongering going on and I'm sure if the antis had there way we would'nt have firearms. If you get a copy of you relevant state firarms leglislation it will lay out what you can and can't have. Here in Qld there has been a lot of talk and roumuring about the .338 lapua and .375 H&H etc. People have had difficulty in obtaining them through weapons licencing to shoot on ranges (or you need a very big private proberty). There was/is a misconception about the State wanting to restrict the availability of these (?). The reasoning I have been provided with by a number of reputable sources is that the Safety templates for all Qld ranges don't meet the requirements for the cartridges (design from Brittish specs for 303's). Also there is nothing to add that someone cant set up a range to meet these.



As for the type of crap that flows in gunshops. I can say after having worked and spent alot of time in gunshops some of the employees behind the counters have IQ's on the worng end of the bell curve and are not only a danger to themselves but to the shooting community in general.

[uncakikki]

Mulga is dead right about the IQ of "some" of the people who work in gunshops and how they, and a lot of shooters in general are theirs (and our) own worst enemies. It has already happenned where the police in various states have had various parts of weapons acts and more importantly the "regulations" ammended because some moron has read something into the act or regs. and brought it to the attention of "suitably powerful" people and voila, the government says "geez we hadn't thought of that....thanks blokes!"

The big calibres are a problem here in Qld (this, I believe, is because of a COAG agreement that so far Qld is the only state that is running with it) because of where and what people intend to use them for (this is your genuine reason under the legislation) If you put down "club competition" you will be asked for more information ie: What competition and where? and this is where you will pretty much get your application refused as there are few, if any ranges that have the safety templates and range approval to accomodate some of the "super hot cartridges" ie: they are not aproved for the energy and or velocity levels that some cartridges produce (refer your clubs "range approval" which should be on display at the club), and then there's the question of suitable competitions. If it's not suitable for the competition which you state in your application you won't get it either, as Qld weapons licensing have to approve all ranges for the competitions you want to shoot on said ranges (this again, forms part of your clubs range approval) and they (QPWL) have on file copies of the rule books for all "approved competitions". So for example, don't ask for a .338 lapua to shoot 500m metallic silhouette as it would probably be deemed unsuitable due to the "target damage rule" and therefore you won't get it even if your range is approved for the energy and velocity levels.

As for the discussion on banning the import of "large calibre" air rifles I would think that whilst the government could do anything, they have no reason to do so as they are currently legal in all states and any reasoning would be fairly shakey at best. Having said that Air soft guns are illegal in qld (and the rest of the country I believe) because of the genuine reason in the legislation refer http://www.police.qld.gov.au/programs/w ... rearms.htm , unfortunately "I just want one" only applies to HSV motor vehicles not firearms!

In short, don't trust the rumour mill! In fact I'd go so far as to challenge people who start spruking on with this sort of stuff as they will cause us irrepairable damage! If in doubt contact the relevant people in your homes states association as they keep a very close eye on such things and can generally provide you with up to date and accurate information.

HTH

Chris

[Con]

The big calibres are a problem here in Qld (this, I believe, is because of a COAG agreement that so far Qld is the only state that is running with it) because of where and what people intend to use them for...

As for the discussion on banning the import of "large calibre" air rifles I would think that whilst the government could do anything, they have no reason to do so as they are currently legal in all states and any reasoning would be fairly shakey at best.

The issue with range templates seems to have originated in SA ... its not new and is not restricted to Qld. Interestingly ... when was/has there been an issue with people shooting larger caliber rifles than the 8mm template that seems to have been the country standard??

Never seems to have been an issue but now suddenly we need to look into it ... hello!?!

Not sure about Qld, but going through your Firearms Act may just show up that since 1996 its been very much up to the Police Commisioner's discretion as to what is and what is not allowed. Reasoning doesn't come into it other than being able to make lots of noise at your politicians which in turn can impact on the Commissioner. If there is a spate of air-rifle hijackings and the Commissioner believes its in the public interest and safety to move against air-rifles ... then that's about it.

JMHO.
Cheers...
Con

[Mulga]

++1

To both comments. As individuals and as an organized group we need to be a squeaky wheel in politicians ears. The SSAA have really got complacent and should maintain continued pressure.

[fenring]

Never heard of it. And TBH I doubt it as all air rifles are licensed just like a powder burner. Is someone more likely to use a very expensive high power airgun to cause mayhem, or a cheap bolt action .22LR?

Sometimes this gossip just starts up of its own accord I reckon.

[uncakikki]

Sorry I should have made myself a little clearer when I said the big calibres were a problem in Qld. What I should have said is... In the eyes of the authorities, some big centrefire calibres are perceived to be a problem because blah blah blah.......I in no way think that they are a problem, on a personal level, and believe that there is no reason why we should not be able to have them. "I just want one!"..... is a perfectly good reason IMHO (we supposedly live in a free country.....yeah right!)

Previous to 1996 (if memory serves me correctly)the administration of ranges was under the control of "the Commonwealth Inspector of Rifle Ranges" and the "defence act" not the individual state police (if I'm wrong on that I will gladly stand corrected but it was around that time the changes started to occur). Life was much simpler then as the people who ran it were somewhat more "informed" than the bunches of "Bureaucrats" we are dealing with now who are effectively making decisions based entirely on numbers, for example: "that thing produces more enrgy than the 8mm so you can't have it!"

I don't think it fair to blame any one association as there are plenty that could be perceived to be pretty slack in this area, but I strongly believe the average shooter has become very complacent in general again (an association is only as strong as its members), and we really all need to be very aware of those in our midst who are all to willing say "oh well that doesn't affect me so why should I bother doing anything about it". That is the sort of divisional attitude that our politicians and Bureaucrats count on so that they can chip away at what we have left.

JMHO

[Con]

Never heard of it. And TBH I doubt it as all air rifles are licensed just like a powder burner. Is someone more likely to use a very expensive high power airgun to cause mayhem, or a cheap bolt action .22LR?

Sometimes this gossip just starts up of its own accord I reckon.

Weren't multi shot PCPs looked at at one stage?

Gossip can be good ... do it and see who jumps. Can tell you a bit about what's being planned.
Cheers...
Con

[Dennis La Varenne]

Thanks for the thoughts everybody. I will have to do some more digging on this. The coot who spruiked about it was very definite about it, so I will get back onto him if I can and try to force him to spill his sources.

I will certainly let everybody know what I find out.

[Con]

Thanks for the thoughts everybody. I will have to do some more digging on this. The coot who spruiked about it was very definite about it, so I will get back onto him if I can and try to force him to spill his sources.

I will certainly let everybody know what I find out.

Contact your Firearms Registry ... gunstore worker here made a cheeky 'joke' about lever guns being banned if taking over 5 shots whilst at a Cartridge Collectors get together. Two days later, District Firearm Officer walks into work to tell him to stop spreading rumours.
Cheers...
Con

[kjd]

Never heard of it. And TBH I doubt it as all air rifles are licensed just like a powder burner. Is someone more likely to use a very expensive high power airgun to cause mayhem, or a cheap bolt action .22LR?

Sometimes this gossip just starts up of its own accord I reckon.

Weren't multi shot PCPs looked at at one stage?

Gossip can be good ... do it and see who jumps. Can tell you a bit about what's being planned.
Cheers...
Con

Or give them ideas....

[Dennis La Varenne]

To all,

I have just been in contact with Forbes Wholesale and Alcock & Pierce and neither of them has heard anything. Tim Brewer from A&P thinks it is just rubbish. I have to hear back from Potter's as well.

Graham Forbes holds a position on the Firearms Traders' Association in Victoria and is very active in the lobbying field. If he has heard nothing, I doubt there is anything happening.

I need to know some facts and be sure of what I am saying so I can tell the originator of the rumour to pull his head in and possibly he will tell his source the same thing.

[fenring]

Seeing as the Firearms Act does not discriminate between different types of air rifles (calibre, power source, action, amount of power) then the Act would have to be changed OR in the case of Vic the CCP would need to make a determination that a particular gun poses an unacceptable risk to public safety and restrict it. The restriction is then legislated.