1000yd Benchrest in AUS
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steven
- .222 Remington
- Posts: 399
- Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:57 pm
- Favourite Cartridge: 6ppc
- Location: Tamworth
Jeff,
Cant disagree with anything you have said. IBS sucks with there format that if you don't winyour detail you're out. Who wants to travel 1000s of k's to shoot one target in Aus.
The only reason I was shooting the Fly in Cantberra was because of the 1000yd shoot the next day. Then they wanted us to join the NRAA? at some ridiculous fee to shoot twice a year then change the rules to suit there poor little sooky members who were used to having there targets pulled.
Steve
Cant disagree with anything you have said. IBS sucks with there format that if you don't winyour detail you're out. Who wants to travel 1000s of k's to shoot one target in Aus.
The only reason I was shooting the Fly in Cantberra was because of the 1000yd shoot the next day. Then they wanted us to join the NRAA? at some ridiculous fee to shoot twice a year then change the rules to suit there poor little sooky members who were used to having there targets pulled.
Steve
Steven i agree about the IBS rules being less than desirable for our needs, but how do we get the now 3 clubs to the table to get a workable outcome for Aus? Jeff has expressed his view on the format and for me i will trade my HG for a set of X18 Callaway irons. Golf is a lot more fun these days as the balls already come loaded. 
Tony Z.
Tony Z.
-
steven
- .222 Remington
- Posts: 399
- Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:57 pm
- Favourite Cartridge: 6ppc
- Location: Tamworth
Tony,
Unless somebody can talk Stuart into using the same rules as TSV, I dont think 1000yd shooting will prosper. Clubs shooting the the same disciplines and using different rules will only ruin it for everyone. Cantberra is only looking after its F Class and bigbore members. They dont care about serious 1000yd shooters. I'm glad Dave and the some of others haven't used the pull and spot method. Maybe some of the Cantberra shooters could elaborate on why they changed the rules to suit themselves. Dave G would know and he should be lurking around here somewhere. Matt P is another that should be able to fill us in.
It also probably comes down to being a good money spinner for them now that they don't have to replace targets and pay a butt crew to pull targets. It would nearly be a 100% profit to for that shoot. If short range benchrest ever does the same thing it will give me a reason to go fishing. Golf sounds like too much exercise unless you buy a cart to drive around in. And by the way Jeff, that Corona was a nice brew. Chuck the lemon away cos you cant get the beer out of the bottle fast enough.
Steve
Unless somebody can talk Stuart into using the same rules as TSV, I dont think 1000yd shooting will prosper. Clubs shooting the the same disciplines and using different rules will only ruin it for everyone. Cantberra is only looking after its F Class and bigbore members. They dont care about serious 1000yd shooters. I'm glad Dave and the some of others haven't used the pull and spot method. Maybe some of the Cantberra shooters could elaborate on why they changed the rules to suit themselves. Dave G would know and he should be lurking around here somewhere. Matt P is another that should be able to fill us in.
It also probably comes down to being a good money spinner for them now that they don't have to replace targets and pay a butt crew to pull targets. It would nearly be a 100% profit to for that shoot. If short range benchrest ever does the same thing it will give me a reason to go fishing. Golf sounds like too much exercise unless you buy a cart to drive around in. And by the way Jeff, that Corona was a nice brew. Chuck the lemon away cos you cant get the beer out of the bottle fast enough.
Steve
That also means that any light gun stock wider than 3" from the Fly shooting fraternity is also illegal. Dave G will have nowhere to go soon as sure as the sun rises, Cantberra will follow suit soon if not already done so. Jacko's old LG, whoever owns that, is no longer legal.
I have to ask the question; why if a shoot is just starting up for the first time, would you want to place a restriction on what you can or can't use before you even see who or what may turn up? I would have thought one would see what the numbers are and the consensus of equipment may be. There is some 50 odd F Class Open rifles down in the Brisvegas area and many of them have some odd stock configurations that will exceed the 3" limit. I have seen some of them and they are more like a light HG in appearance with stocks fitted with pods etc.
A lot of thought has gone into this one. The NRAA is dumber than what i previously thought they were, because if they bothered to look in their own rule book, right at the very back it clearly states that for 1000 IBS, "refer to 1000 Yard IBS International Rules". Now the rules for that shoot do not state anywhere any stock limits for rifles in LG, just the simple paragraph that states, "Guns shooting in the Light Gun class weigh no more than 17 pounds including scope or other sighting devices".
Introducing a rule like this without any consultation with anbody is what the NRAA, and the people it attracts, have a track record of doing well. This autocratic behaviour stems from a belief that they are the elitists of this sport and that they can do what they wish because in their minds they firmly believe that they know what is best for the majority. This is the clear reason why the NRAA has diminished its numbers, by self affliction, from more than 35,000 members in 1980 to where they are now, in a commanding position ruling over less than 3,500 lemmings. Their days are numbered.
Tony Z.
I have to ask the question; why if a shoot is just starting up for the first time, would you want to place a restriction on what you can or can't use before you even see who or what may turn up? I would have thought one would see what the numbers are and the consensus of equipment may be. There is some 50 odd F Class Open rifles down in the Brisvegas area and many of them have some odd stock configurations that will exceed the 3" limit. I have seen some of them and they are more like a light HG in appearance with stocks fitted with pods etc.
A lot of thought has gone into this one. The NRAA is dumber than what i previously thought they were, because if they bothered to look in their own rule book, right at the very back it clearly states that for 1000 IBS, "refer to 1000 Yard IBS International Rules". Now the rules for that shoot do not state anywhere any stock limits for rifles in LG, just the simple paragraph that states, "Guns shooting in the Light Gun class weigh no more than 17 pounds including scope or other sighting devices".
Introducing a rule like this without any consultation with anbody is what the NRAA, and the people it attracts, have a track record of doing well. This autocratic behaviour stems from a belief that they are the elitists of this sport and that they can do what they wish because in their minds they firmly believe that they know what is best for the majority. This is the clear reason why the NRAA has diminished its numbers, by self affliction, from more than 35,000 members in 1980 to where they are now, in a commanding position ruling over less than 3,500 lemmings. Their days are numbered.
Tony Z.
Good post Dave. Sums up the last 8 years in a nutshell.
Shortly i will be having a meeting with our SSAA club president to discuss the future of 1000 IBS in Townsville. He, being involved with the NRAA over many years, has expressed his view that our shoot should be in the NRAA domain simply because it encroaches into long range shooting. Not a view shared by myself, and that being the case, the Fly and our yet to be shot 600 IBS may aswell join the bunch. As far as i can see, benchrest is benchrest, whether it be at 50 metres like Rimfire Hunterclass, or indeed at 1000 yards like we shoot now. Benchrest is the domain of the SSAA.
Forgetting our situation for the moment, it is apparent to me that in the last few years the NRAA has changed dramatically, and while the inclusion of some new disciplines may be seen as a new heading in a positive direction by many, i for one see this more as a death rattle of an Association about to be defunct. I have long advocated the need in Aus for more than one controlling body as a monopoly by one is not in anyones interest, but i cannot see the NRAA with its "company" men making decisions for the masses as that other Association we may need.
Looking at this from my perspective from having been involved with the NRAA and many of its personalities since 1980, i can assure those reading this that if the situation was that the NRAA numbers were strong and increasing, the likes of Field Class, F Class, Service Rifle and possibly now the yet to be named 1000 yard shoot held in Cantberra and Brisvegas, would never be allowed to grace the hallowed ranges of the Fullbore shooter.
Having said that, i do not see why we, the 1000 yard shooters of Townsville, should join an Association that may not be around as we know it in a few short years as all i see up our way is Fullbore numbers ever decreasing and the ranges they used, Bowen, Ayr, Halifax, Ravenshoe, Homehill all closed down, with Atherton, Herberton and Mareeba not knowing their immediate future. That leaves only Townsville, the only freehold range, for most of North Queensland. Safe one would think, but when the NRAA dies, its future is not garanteed.
The chances of us joining with the NRAA are remote as i cannot see what has changed in the last six years for us to do so. Talk of insurance problems have surfaced over the last few years, but as the SSAA is the insurer for all ranges Australia wide, and having already gotten the blessing from our State and National presidents to do as we do, i cannot see any gain in jumping ship.
Worst case scenario is that there may be some LGs and HGs for sale, and if that may seem extreme to some, joining the NRAA will lead to that same conclusion anyway.
Tony Z.
ps. Having talked to a number of senior people from both the SSAA and NRAA in recent times, it is clear that the trend for both Associations is to steer towards disciplines that are Internationally linked in both their rules and participation purely from the aspect of both survival and insurance application. As an example, it has come to be known that when the last pistol buyback was on, some diciplines were saved from decimation because of this international link and were given due consideration. It is easier to justify both on those grounds, and it was duely pointed out by one NRAA member that by not joining the international brotherhood (rules), that discipline was of no interest and could not be justified for inclusion. F Class is going down this international road now and it surprises me that the NRAA having this ethic are allowing a hybrid form of 1000 yards shooting to develope. Unless that decision is purely commercial.
Shortly i will be having a meeting with our SSAA club president to discuss the future of 1000 IBS in Townsville. He, being involved with the NRAA over many years, has expressed his view that our shoot should be in the NRAA domain simply because it encroaches into long range shooting. Not a view shared by myself, and that being the case, the Fly and our yet to be shot 600 IBS may aswell join the bunch. As far as i can see, benchrest is benchrest, whether it be at 50 metres like Rimfire Hunterclass, or indeed at 1000 yards like we shoot now. Benchrest is the domain of the SSAA.
Forgetting our situation for the moment, it is apparent to me that in the last few years the NRAA has changed dramatically, and while the inclusion of some new disciplines may be seen as a new heading in a positive direction by many, i for one see this more as a death rattle of an Association about to be defunct. I have long advocated the need in Aus for more than one controlling body as a monopoly by one is not in anyones interest, but i cannot see the NRAA with its "company" men making decisions for the masses as that other Association we may need.
Looking at this from my perspective from having been involved with the NRAA and many of its personalities since 1980, i can assure those reading this that if the situation was that the NRAA numbers were strong and increasing, the likes of Field Class, F Class, Service Rifle and possibly now the yet to be named 1000 yard shoot held in Cantberra and Brisvegas, would never be allowed to grace the hallowed ranges of the Fullbore shooter.
Having said that, i do not see why we, the 1000 yard shooters of Townsville, should join an Association that may not be around as we know it in a few short years as all i see up our way is Fullbore numbers ever decreasing and the ranges they used, Bowen, Ayr, Halifax, Ravenshoe, Homehill all closed down, with Atherton, Herberton and Mareeba not knowing their immediate future. That leaves only Townsville, the only freehold range, for most of North Queensland. Safe one would think, but when the NRAA dies, its future is not garanteed.
The chances of us joining with the NRAA are remote as i cannot see what has changed in the last six years for us to do so. Talk of insurance problems have surfaced over the last few years, but as the SSAA is the insurer for all ranges Australia wide, and having already gotten the blessing from our State and National presidents to do as we do, i cannot see any gain in jumping ship.
Worst case scenario is that there may be some LGs and HGs for sale, and if that may seem extreme to some, joining the NRAA will lead to that same conclusion anyway.
Tony Z.
ps. Having talked to a number of senior people from both the SSAA and NRAA in recent times, it is clear that the trend for both Associations is to steer towards disciplines that are Internationally linked in both their rules and participation purely from the aspect of both survival and insurance application. As an example, it has come to be known that when the last pistol buyback was on, some diciplines were saved from decimation because of this international link and were given due consideration. It is easier to justify both on those grounds, and it was duely pointed out by one NRAA member that by not joining the international brotherhood (rules), that discipline was of no interest and could not be justified for inclusion. F Class is going down this international road now and it surprises me that the NRAA having this ethic are allowing a hybrid form of 1000 yards shooting to develope. Unless that decision is purely commercial.
