Run a condition or pick through it??

[albow]

Hi all

Being new to the LR BR game I have tried a few different approaches over the past six months when shooting a match from shooting them as quick as possible on a condition.... or at least what I thought was a consistent condition to picking my way through.

Due to the small number of matches shot I have not found one technique to be substantially better than the other so I am looking for some input from the more seasoned shooters out there to pass on what you have found to provide you with the best results for group and score.

[Ackley Improved]

Maybe the rifle can dictate how you shoot the match?

If I remember correctly, you are shooting a 30-284 in a 17lb rifle, so there will be recoil that is significant. With a rifle with greater recoil, time between shots is increased getting the rifle back on track, so the machine gun technique is a little slower than using a light recoiling rifle. Maybe the waiting game is best here?

For myself, I like to shoot all my shots on the one condition. Remember I am using one of those now infamous POPGUNS, and a Seb coaxial rest which allows me to go between the sighter and target quickly!

The ones that can hold off for the same conditions and shoot a slow course of fire and do it well will always be a better shooter than I. They can read the wind, and have confidence in their reading skills.

That said, I am a machine gun shooter, and with a 17lb Dasher this method is very easy, specially with a left feed, right eject. I watch the flags, waiting for a hold that I believe is good to shoot on. When I see it again, I will put down a sighter, and then another sighter down as well. (If I am confident with my first sighter I will go stright to the record.) After this and I am happy I will go stright to the record and fire as many shots down as I can, hopefully all of them without the condition changing. If it does and I see it, I will then use my last sighter when I see as the same condition and then put the remaining rounds on the target.

Miss that change though and you could have all your rounds off the target!

With a bit of practice I have been able to get my shots down range pretty quickly!

What have you done best with? Perfect it!

Cheers
AI

[Rinso]

albow,

First dont listen to AI ... bloody popgunner
Mate to be honest I think you need to do both well, by that I mean that you need to adapt to the conditions the range presents on the day. Somedays rapid fire is great and will be perfect but you need a condition that will hold for a minute to make it work.
Other days you just have to shoot on the breeze ie fire a shot and wait for the condition to return to fire the next or you can adjust by best guess shot to shot of course you have to see bullet holes for that to work.
I know thats not much help but my advice would be pick what is most comfortable to you, what you are most confident doing and and run with it.
End of the day sometimes you just have to suck it and see ... remember somedays your a windscreen, somedays your a moth.

cheers
Rinso

[Tony Z]

I'm with Rinso on this one.

[Ackley Improved]

I guess to do wait for the same condition but I machinegun them all down in that time. The first time its holds I will put down as many as possible, and it the condition changes I stop. I will wait for the condition again, use my last sighter to coonfirm and then machinegun the rest... So I guess its a bit of both!

Cheers
AI

[Ned Kelly]

G'Day All,
running or picking..........well it really depends on the weather offered. Sometimes it is constant enough to get 5 away fast, but in my experience I knew using windage tops/speed screws I personally could not. Now that I have a LBRPLeject BAT and gear stick rest, hopefully I can get it all sorted out and running smoothly, I'll will be trying to run a group in 30 seconds or less.

There was no way I'd have considered running at Portland last week because I felt the wind conditions were barely allowing picking let alone running a group. Better shooters than me may have been able to do so, but with the flags were switching, and pick up's and let off's in wind speed and angle by so much, you just had to pick away or definately end up spraying 'em across the paper.

This spray and pray technique used at the wrong time can lead to much swearing along the firing line if one is not careful. Sensitive souls may be offended by such language.

The general rule is IF the condition lasts 30 seconds or so AND you can shoot fast enough go for it. You may only get 1/2 your group down, and need to check the sighter again and have another go.

Really you need to have both skills in your tool box to use as the conditions dictate, sometime using both for the same group. Only practice can develope these skills and over good flags in all weather.

Ultimately, the key is knowing when to STOP running!

In the end you win some and you lose some, trick is not to lose as many shots out of the group as the rest of the pack!

Cheerio Ned

[a.JR]

in

[albow]

I understand that both techniques need to be a skill that you have to get the most from the conditions on any set day however I was just wondering if you have found one gave better group results or scores.

The reason I ask is because I was looking back over my targets and have found that when picking through conditions I seem to have one and sometime two shots that seems to be "out" of the group showing that I obviously have missed something on the flags. The targets shot on the run seem to be better group wise.

When I start looking at score though the groups that I have run on a condition do not seem to score as good as the ones that have been shot by picking through the conditions.

Has anyone else analysed their groups in this way to see what results you were getting and if so what was the trend?

[Blackpete]

Hi Al,
mate i have not yet analysed my targets but one thing i can say is that in the past i have found myself too scared to pick through conditions and therefore machine gun my shots. i am only now finding the confidence to try and pick my way through a string with varying results. for me it is hard to make sence of ten different flag (wind) directions and lately i have been trying to work only off a couple of flags to reduce my confusion.

i guess what i'm trying to say is, you own experiances will give you the best results, of course keep annoy'in the shit out of JR & TZ, i've been doing that for few years now, my biggest problem is i'm a slow learner and suffer drasticly from short term memory lose so i have to ask the same questions several times.

mate from what you have achieved in six months i don't think it will be too long before you're mopping the floor with the rest of us so don't worry too much.

Pete.

[Tony Z]

Must have worked for ya Pete, new score record and all.

[Mick]

I think to start out, you are probably best off picking through conditions. It teaches you to read the wind properly, which is always going to be an advantage. As we all know, a condition you started shooting on can go away very quickly, and not come back. Knowing what to do in that situation is only really going to be learned by being able to read the wind and compensate for big changes.

Once you are confident that you can read the wind, and can correctly pick a condition to run, the machine gunning method works very well.

One thing I see pretty often is people either waiting out a good condition and second guessing themselves. I can only really put that down to their confidence in their wind reading ability.

Another thing I see is the missing of big changes when trying to machine gun them down, and I think thats mostly because of paying more attention to belting them down as quick as possible and completely ignoring what the wind is doing. Kind of need to run at a pace where you can keep a balance between watching the condition, but still shooting quickly so you dont lose the condition.

Both ways have their merits, but depend on what you are most comfortable with, and what the condition is like on any given day.