New long range rifle?

[Ned Kelly]

G'Day all,
I have been reading as much as I can on the 6BR, 6Dasher, 6BRX, 6x47lapua, 6XC, 6-284 etc and am finding it difficult to identify a standout cartridge that performs at the longer distances. So, I am after suggestions based on your first hand experience, for a long range cartridge.

I do not want to build a dedicated FO only rifle at this stage and want to utilise an existing rifle. This is to be based on my Hall S BR rifle. It has a 308 bolt face in a Borden carbon fibre stock that is used as my 10.5 lb LV BR rifle. I still want to use it as a back up BR rifle and with a quick barrel change use it for FO and 500m Fly shoots. There are some conditions that I want to meet, see below:

•As I have a limited budget and initially need only a barrel, weight system, cases & dies.

•Must initially be a 6mm cartridge (all my BR stuff is based around 6mm)

•Easily formed wildcats welcomed! No harder than a 6ppc to form.

•Barrel to be around starting at minimum 26" long probably with a weight in the butt stock to maintain rifle balance.

•I expect to use in local FO matches where 80% of matches are up to 800m (875yds) 20% of matches out to 1000yds

•Loading port measures 2.5" long by 1" and a bolt throw approx 3.25"

•I do not want to remove the bolt in order to remove fired case so cases would be limited to max OAL of 2"

•Describe your experience with tuners good or bad

Please feel to add any further info, again based on your first hand experience. I expect there are many other shooters who will benefit from your replies as well so I encourage you to make the effort to reply to my queries.

Many thanks,
Cheerio Ned

[singleshot]

In your case I would go 6mmBR.
Excellent brass, easy to tune , very accurate, good barrel life, excellent long range projectiles to choose from.

Cameron

[Rinso]

Ned,
Based on having one I cant do but I can say that I am building a 6x47 as FO / Light Fly gun.

Why 6x47 ? I have seen the 6BR and Dasher the dasher has the edge there and I believe based on what I have seen, heard & raed that the 6x47 will shade the Dasher.

Lapua brass is readily available and cases are formed from 6.5x47 by 1 pass in a 6mm die.

All indictaions are that this will be a very good round.

6BRX & 6XC very limited in Australia .. 6-284 will be a tight fit and I hope you like your g/smith because the 6.5 version is hard on barrels so dont expect you would get much barrel life in 6mm format.

I know several other very good shooters also on the 6x47 path.

cheers
Rinso

[Ackley Improved]

Ok

I'll chime in.

The 6mmBR is a good choice, but I feel the IMproved versions are just that little better for the added velocity.

I have found the Dasher excellent. I would prefer it over a BRX as it has a slightly longer neck.


I would not choose the XC as the 6-6.5X47L lapua is available. IT is easier for brass, and dies are no problem.

6-284... great caliber... to short a barrel life I feel.

Choice comes down to a 6mmDasher or a 6-6.5X47L.

Dasher dies are more expensive. The 6mmBR brass is very very very good. Only uses 34grains at most(I run 33). Down side, fireforming and it gives up 1-150fps to a 6-6.5X47L. The Dasher shoots between 2950-3050fps, which is easily enough for 500m. Its also very easy to get to shoot. Very light recoil.

6.6.5X47L. Has velocity advantage over Dasher, but also uses 7-10grain more powder for that extra 100-150fps. Dies are no problem, brass Lapua (do not know how it compares to the 6mmBR), easy to fireform.

Using your current rifle, I would go to a 28" LV contour barrel to help balance, and chamber for the Dasher if 500m is going to be the maximum distance. If you plan to shoot to 1000yd, then the 6-6.5X47L will have the edge.

Cheers
AI

[Ned Kelly]

G'Day all,
Thanks for the input so far it mirrors my own ideas as well. Perhaps a little more background info is needed. I plan on shooting FO around Woodend, so that is Anakie, Werribee, Bacchus Marsh, Bendigo, Castlemaine and 500m Fly at Little River all around 1 hours travel or so from home. Mostly the longer distances would be Bendigo 1000yds, Anakie with 800m(875yds) or Werribee 800yds.

Most of the competitions are usually 3/5/600yds. Given I shoot BR matchs as well, I'm only going to shoot one day LR events. There is only so far the shooting $ can stretch!

I have looked long and hard at the 6BR and its wildcats and the 6-6.5x47lapua. It really comes down to availablity of good brass and quality of the shelf reloading dies such as redding/forster I suppose. I am looking for real world experiences in order to help make my decision.

Any preferences in die manufacturers for the cartridges that you have chosen?

Again thanks for the input, and any other info greatly appreciated

Cheerio Ned

[Ackley Improved]

For the Dasher, I am using Redding Type S FL and NK die, but after the 2nd firing, I have gone to FL sizing everytime. For a seater, I had a 6mmBR comp. seater reamed, and it works perfect.

I see Forster offers Dasher dies.

Out to 600yds the Dasher will work fine.

My rifle is 17lbs, and the bag handling is great. my follow up shots can be very quick and precise. I am very happy with my decision. Fireforming loads for my rifle were super accurate as well.

From what I have heard, people using the 6-6.5X47L load to a velocity of around the 3050fps. It gives good case life and its accurate around there. The Dasher is very close to the 3000fps, so it really doesnt give much up, although the 6-6.5X47L has got the extra boiler room.

Cheers
AI

[shane]

Gday Ned,
Mate of the rounds you mention above i would go for either the 6BRX or the 6x47 Lapua.

Both are good medium sized efficient 6mm rounds with brass easily formed and dies readily available. The dies for the BRX are just unaltered 6br dies not set as deep.

Thay are large enough to give good balistics at longer range but not so big as to burn out barrels quick.

They are short enough to eject empty cases from your action.

I would go for a 28" barrel and balance it to suit that.

I have only just started playing with tuners on centrefire rifles so i cannot give a lot of info just yet. But they show potential. The problem is there is a lot of opinion around regarding tuners but thats all it is 'opinion'. People have not played around with them enough to give accurate facts on them. So after i give them a good run i will make comments.
cheers,
Shane

[Ned Kelly]

G'Day Shane,
thanks for the input
Cheerio Ned

[Tony Z]

Shane, tuners were something i played with some time back and gave them a lot of time to be fair. I have not revisited them in the last five years because i feel that the outcome for me will be the same as before. They can on the day be tuned to a fine degree of accuracy, but they do change day to day as is evidenced by another forum thread where talk of tuning during a match has been a hot topic. So nothing has realy changed. The best tuner of the lot is the stretcher tube as it stays constant. What i can't understand is that some of the top long range shooters in the US sing the praises of their tube guns, and yet so few that hear are not listening. Here in Aus, JR wins most Fly shoots he goes to, holds the score and group aggs at 1K and just happens to run a tube gun. He just pours the powder in until the case says i'm outta here, then backs it off a half a grain and shoots it year round only paying attention to pressure signs. With a tuner, half the barrel life will be lost before one even gets to competition and even then the chase is ongoing.

Tony Z.

[Tony Z]

I must clarify that a tube is not a tuner as such, but rather a structural stabiliser of sorts. It does with force what a tuner tries to do with finesse, and that is to keep the muzzle at the same location shot to shot. Slight changes in atmospherics and load pressures have tuners not quite right all the time. Tubes rely on strength and or tension to do the job, so load and atmospherics have nowhere near the same effect. The race in the US now is to get on top of the atmospherics by either altering the charges or the tuners during BR matches. Both have flies on them. When i did my first tube barrels, the one thing that they all had in common was that the loads were all good, just some were better than others. This is something you will not see with a tuner as some of the groups can be truly enormous, or brilliant for 4 shots with the fitfh in the car park. When it goes wrong it goes big time. With the tube, the only worry is is the lock nut up tight enough. JR can tell you of a goup nice and tight in the ten ring for 9 shots, and the tenth sitting in the 6 ring of a 1K target.

Tony Z.